1. As an expert on Eastern Mediterranean cooking, what do you think are the major differences between Greek and Middle Eastern mezze, and casual cooking in general?
For me, Turkish and Greek mezze can be put in one group and Syrian and Lebanese in another. Of course, there are shared dishes between all these countries, the best-known being stuffed vine leaves, but in each country, the leaves are prepared noticeably differently.
In Greece, the accent is more on cooked dishes, which are on the whole rather plainly flavoured, and most savoury pastries are made with phyllo; in Turkey, there are also more cooked mezze, but you start having a variety of raw salads, and different topped breads; and the flavours start becoming a little more complex.
However, it is not until you get to Syria and Lebanon that you can start choosing from a wider selection of raw mezze, both vegetables and meat. Also there is a profusion of fresh herbs and crudités in the mezze of these two countries, and the spicing of the dishes is more complex with stronger, often lemony flavours.
2. Tell us a few words about the essence of tabbûlé, its history, and why you think it has been so badly abused by chefs all over the world.
Tabbûlé is probably one of the most misinterpreted dishes in the global repertoire - it has now become a global dish. Not only that, but tabbûlé has become a generic term applied to all kinds of salads and no longer really refers to the original Lebanese salad. Tabbûlé is one of the few national dishes we have.
There are two versions: the classic version where the main ingredients are parsley and tomatoes, with a little spring onion and mint and only a smattering of fine burghul (the amount varies from family to family, or region to region, but it is always minimal compared to the herbs and vegetables). The seasoning can be plain, with lemon juice, olive oil and salt and pepper; or it can be more intriguing with the addition of Lebanese 7-spice mixture and cinnamon. Some people also add a little chilli.
The other version is called white tabbûlé, where the parsley is replaced by finely shredded white cabbage and the burghul is more prominent. Perhaps this version was developed for when there was no parsley available; or perhaps it is a regional variation. I have not yet found any information on its origins.
As for why tabbûlé has been so badly abused by western chefs and home cooks, Claudia Roden told me once that the mistake may have arisen from the first recipe she gave for tabbûlé in her seminal Middle Eastern cookbook. The quantity of burghul she gave in that recipe was far too large. She subsequently amended the recipe in the revised edition, reducing the amount of burghul, but the mistake stuck and ever since, chefs and others make tabbûlé that is closer to kissir, a Turkish burghul salad, than the real Lebanese tabbûlé. And now that the salad has gone global, it has gone even further away from its origins, with chefs putting their own twist, adding lentils, cucumber, feta cheese, etc.
I don’t mind the variations so much but I do wish chefs gave these creations a different name, as many bear little or no resemblance to tabbûlé as the Lebanese understand it.
3. Give us some more examples of traditional Lebanese Summer dishes, and tell us about your kind of mussaqa’a.
There are plenty of Lebanese summer dishes to choose from, including a whole range of dishes described as cooked in oil (bil-zeyt ) such as vegetarian stuffed vegetables (mehshi bil-zeyt), where the herbs, tomatoes, onion and rice stuffing is flavoured with sumac and lemon juice, or flat green beans cooked in tomato sauce with a large amount of unpeeled garlic cloves (lubye bil zeyt), or okra in tomato and coriander sauce (bamye bil-zeyt).
There is also fish kibbe, where the fish is finely ground with coriander and onion, then mixed with fine burghul and seasoned. Half the mixture is then spread in a fine layer over the bottom of a pie dish, a seasoned mixture of sliced onion and pine nuts tossed in olive oil is spread all over, and then another fine layer of fish mixture s spread over the filling. The top of the crustless pie is scored to make geometric patterns and baked.
Then there is the group of fatteh dishes, where a layer of broken up toasted pita bread is topped with boiled meat and chickpeas, or fried aubergines which are in turn topped with garlic flavoured yoghurt and the whole thing is garnished with toasted pine nuts.
Mussaqa’a is another summer dish but ours differs considerably from the Greek version. We make two versions. One has small aubergines that are peeled in stripes and fried whole, before being ped in a tomato, onion and chickpeas sauce. That version is cooked on top of the stove. The seasoning is very plain, in fact simply salt.
The other version is made with fried slices of aubergines that are layered in a pie dish, and each layer is spread with an onion and tomato sauce, then the dish is baked. The taste of the two versions is fairly similar, but the texture differs with the small aubergines mussaqa’a having somewhat of a crunch because of the added chickpeas.
4. If you were to be remembered by one single recipe which one would you consider the most representative of your personal temperament?
I guess fattûsh is the recipe that is the most representative of my temperament. I love simple, fresh and healthy food with strong flavours and fattûsh is one of my ideal salads, combining the freshness of the raw herbs and vegetables with the crunch of toasted pita and the zing of the tart sumac, and of course the lovely aroma and flavour of olive oil. I often have fattûsh for lunch.
Another reason why it is representative of my temperament is that I am very meticulous and patient, and I enjoy the methodical preparation of fattûsh with the neat chopping of herbs, slicing of onions and cucumbers, and the cutting of tomatoes in bite-sized pieces, not to mention the making of the pita chips to add to the salad at the last minute.
5. Tell us a few words about your last two books.
Modern Mezze is a highly illustrated book with a limited selection of mezze dishes from Greece, Turkey, Syria, Lebanon and Morocco even if they don’t have a mezze tradition as such in the latter. However, many Moroccan salads are perfect to add to a modern mezze spread. My aim in this book is to introduce a wide readership to the delights of mezze. I have simplified the recipes and modernised them while keeping the traditional flavours.
Savory Baking from the Mediterranean, on the other hand, is a more comprehensive volume which introduces the reader to the traditions of bread-making and savory baking from all around the Mediterranean. I provide the reader with an overview of different Mediterranean breads, savoury pastries and pies; and I also give the reader hints to help him/her achieve good results baking at home; and finally I offer a selection of about 130 traditional recipes for all kinds of different breads: flat, raised, hard, flavoured and so on, and for pies, savoury pastries, pies and tarts. They are two very different books which reflect my expertise as well as passion.
6. How were you inspired to begin the food trips you are organizing in the Middle East? Will Greece be included on one of your future food trips?
I was asked to take a group of food professionals to Morocco to introduce them to Moroccan food. They were looking for inspiration to produce a whole range of ready-made Mediterranean dishes, and I was their expert guide.
The trip was a real eye-opener for them. They were so impressed with what I showed them, and gave them to taste, that I thought it would be fun to do the same for regular travelers, who very rarely get to know the food of the country they visit.
They are usually steered towards touristy restaurants; and they often are not brave enough to venture to local markets or make friends and visit them at homes so that they may experience the food as locals do. Language is often a barrier and my intention with these culinary tours is to help travellers acquire an insider’s knowledge of the food and cooking of the country visited.
As for Greece, it is definitely on my list to include in future programmes, especially the islands where the food is very interesting.
7. Have you visited Greece? What are your impressions of the people, food, and culture?
Yes. Many times. My first visit was in the early 1970’s and my last, a few years ago. People in Athens are slightly less friendly than anywhere else. My favourite people and food are on the islands. I found that Crete and Simi had the most exciting food, as well as fabulous landscapes and lovely people. I also loved Kea, Kassos, and Mykonos, and I had delicious meals in various restaurants in Athens, and of course everywhere on the street and in different markets. The culture in Greece is astonishing. There are so many well-preserved heritage sites and the art in museums is breathtaking. I love to go through the sculpture galleries and imagine I have gone back in time to live with the gorgeous creatures depicted!
